Both the Biden administration as well as Governor Kathy Hochul’s first budget plan for New York are focusing on green energy to stimulate the economy. This week, New York State Department of Environmental Conservation Commissioner Basil Seggos was in Plattsburgh to speak at the Quebec-New York Transportation-Aerospace Rendezvous. For a wide-ranging interview, he met up with Pat Bradley from WAMC’s North Country Bureau.
The North Country, especially the North Country surrounding Plattsburgh, is doing an extraordinary job in advancing the economy’s future. When you talk of clean transportation, you think about Plattsburgh. Nova Bus and Bombardier are clean technologies that will help us meet our climate goals. It’s great to be up there. North Country Chamber of Commerce and our friends in Quebec, as well as our business partners from all over the U.S., are all here for this, these relationships. Our climate act is setting the stage for incredible job growth in New York, I believe. We can see that every job lost will result in nine new jobs as we transition to the clean economy. This will result in the creation of hundreds of thousands of new jobs throughout the state. Plattsburgh, in the North Country, has a significant advantage. They have known for some time that there is an opportunity to use open spaces, right? With a trained workforce at the ex-airbase, they can start making some amazing technologies and putting them out all over the country. We ship buses, clean buses to San Francisco and Houston, and eventually, we hope into, all over New York. They’re now ahead. But we believe that this will open up opportunities for other parts of the State, particularly Buffalo, because of the certainty we provide with our climate law, and ultimately the regulations, and the incentives. We have a similar manufacturing history, lots of trained workers, and strong labor presence. This will allow us to see an incredible increase in production of the products we need to transition this economy away from fossil fuels.
I also understand that the state encourages more green school buses, and that the state is also transforming its fleet of vehicles to be greener.
That’s correct. Pat, it’s a great opportunity to address the climate crisis and reduce emissions to build this new economy. Governor Hochul supports electric school buses strongly. For me, as a parent, I put my children on the bus today and it was a diesel bus. It’s something I think about every day. Everyone who has ever been on a school bus or green can smell diesel fumes. It’s dangerous for the children. It’s bad for the environment, and it’s bad for the driver. The governor wants to ensure that we move as quickly as possible. Every new bus sold after 2020 will be electric. All buses sold after 2027 will be electric by 2035. This is going to have huge implications for our health and economy. It will also help us reduce emissions from the transportation sector. We are going big in this area. We are going big on the transition of our own fleets. That’s right, we want to live by what we preach. We must ensure that New York has a green fleet and that all workers have access to EVs. We intend to set an example.
Plattsburgh has been working on transitioning to green manufacturing, NOVA Bus being the most commuter bus type of manufacturing. Where are the green school buses? Are there any manufacturing facilities in New York that can produce green vehicles and green jobs?
Right. We want these jobs here. Lyon Electric, smartly opening a small sub-office outside of Albany a few year ago, I believe, because they were aware that we were moving to the economy that was changing now. They saw a potential market. They have plans to expand in the US, which I know. Recently, I attended an event at the Capitol. It was right outside the Empire State Plaza. Bluebird, the national bus company, was also present. They are beginning to shift to electric. I forgot the name of the manufacturer but they were retrofitting buses from old factories. This involved removing the diesel engine, installing a battery and a drive, and finally having that option. These buses are typically built to last at least 10 years. You can retrofit a bus to make it electrical if it is in good condition. We want to ensure that this happens in New York and ultimately bring those businesses here.
Unknown Speaker 4:40
Basil Seggos, I can’t chat with the Commissioner for Environmental Conservation and not talk about the Adirondacks.
Oh, yes, I’d imagine.
Yes. The Adirondack Rail Trail, in fact, is still under construction. Some of the tracks have been removed. What is the status of the rail trail and what are the plans for the construction season?
Great question. It’s so exciting to be right where we are. We finally saw the rails being pulled up, and could now transition to the construction of the trail. It took many years to get to this stage. Some of that litigation took years. Some of that planning took years. We are here nevertheless. We signed a transfer of jurisdiction agreement with the state Department of Transportation last week. So now the rail trail is DECs. This is a project that we are working closely with the Office of General Services. It will eventually be opened in phases beginning next year. This trail will be accessible to hikers and runners, as well as bikers. In the winter, snowmobile riders will be able to use it. So, this will start with an aggressive timeline, and eventually, the North Country will get what they’ve been wanting for years, which is a solid trail from Lake Placid to Tupper Lake.
What percentage of the rail trail can be completed in this construction season? Or is this still part the initial process?
It’s going take several years. It will likely take two to three full seasons to finish. We’ll finish it in sections so that the trail can be used. Construction will be visible to those who use the trail. They will see surveyors on the trail. They’ll be able to see people working on the culverts which have been damaged over time. We will make it as accessible as possible while we are doing construction. This is part of the I believe the benefit of our approach is that it will be a usable path, by and large, until the moment we cut the ribbon in 2024 and 25.
Speaking of trails that aren’t rail trails Commissioner Seggos said that the High Peaks trails have been a major problem in the Adirondacks for the past few decades. What other plans are there to alleviate the overuse of the High Peaks? This is especially true when we see the border opening and the Canadians returning in. During the pandemic, we saw many of the more southern areas discover the Adirondacks. What are you doing now to alleviate some of the overwhelming use of Adirondack hiking trails
We are so happy that New Yorkers discovered the Adirondacks, Catskills. They are treasures, and the world knows that now. We are thrilled to welcome back our Canadian friends. It is a challenge for us as managers. As you all know, we have been discussing this issue since late 2015, when I was elected commissioner. We are concerned about the Adirondacks’ use and our concerns. We want the trails to be maintained and the business to remain in the communities. We made good progress over the past year. In the last two years we worked hard to establish a hiker reservation system and parking reservation system at AMR (Adirondack Mountains Reserve) parking lot. This was a very successful year. However, safety was our main concern. We saw people parking on the side of the roads and cars speeding by at 50 miles per hour. It was not a safe environment. Last year was a great experience. We received I believe 17,000 reservations through the system, and most of those were processed very well. Everyone was able to safely return to the backcountry. We’ll do it again next year. We have just made an announcement about this in the last few days. We are also working on other use strategies. We are encouraging people to visit other areas of High Peaks. It has been quite successful and well-received by other Adirondacks. In some of these areas, people are seeing tourism for the first-time in a long while. We have made investments in parking lots at ORDA, right, new trailheads on the ORDA facility Mt. Van Hoevenberg will take people to the High Peaks. We have done amazing work with the state DOT to paint striping on roads so that people know where to park. We know that we will have large crowds this year. We are going to be prepared for it. We’ll be talking with our local and state partners about that to make sure that we’re ready for the crowd. We will continue to make huge investments in the trails. It is important that you choose trails that will last 100 years. Don’t take someone up a mountain; these trails can easily erode.
You might be asking yourself, “What do you think about the state budget currently being worked on for the DEC and especially the Environmental Protection Fund?”
It’s a remarkable budget. It is truly extraordinary. It is. I believe that the governor’s first meeting with the EPA administrator was the second day she took office in August. She made it clear that she was going be a strong supporter for the environment and make it a top priority for her. You can now move on to her budget, the State of the State. She proposed a $4 billion bond bill, a $400 million EPF Fund (Environmental Protection Fund), a figure that was $300 million above last year. We have an unprecedented amount going into clean drinking water. Another $500 million will be going into clean drinking water, another Superfund investment. My agency has never seen such a strong commitment to the environment. We can now think beyond maintaining the environment in these areas and start to consider making future investments in the environment. These are things that we have been thinking about for years via the Bond Act. If we have four to five $6 billion bonds acts that come out of this budget negotiation, it’s a chance for New York to be truly climate resilient. When you think about the heat, the severe weather, and the threat to our state, you think about making our trail systems and road systems more resilient. All that runoff from roads gets into ditches which then overflow into streams that cause flooding and damage communities during storms. If we can make that water run the right way and make it climate-friendly, then we are really investing in the future state.
Would you consider hiring more staff and rangers at the DEC?
We did see a significant increase in fill levels. We were at around 2,900 at DEC when I took over. Remember that we were at almost 4,000 in total twelve years ago. We took a serious hit in the 2000s. The governor made it clear she wanted to rebuild DEC staffing, giving us the 129 additional lines. We also received her support to create a new academy, the Ranger Academy. We don’t just hire Rangers. There is a rigorous vetting process that must be completed before we can create an academy that lasts six month. We are thrilled to have the largest academy for Rangers. This academy will be launched in May, right here in the Adirondacks. For the first time in a very long time, we have an academy here in the Adirondacks. So we will be building that force up very strategically starting in the new year with as many as 40 new Rangers. The academy will be up and running as soon as possible. Also, we’ve had retirements and attrition. This is a valuable part our workforce. We’ve seen it all at DEC, and all agencies, especially during COVID. But I want to rebuild, I want my Rangers to be able to go out on the field.
Basil Seggos, you mention the Environmental Bond Act. As you mentioned, the Governor proposed $4Billion. There have been estimates of $6 billion. That is quite a large amount. Do you plan to campaign actively for this once it is set in stone by the legislature? It is obvious that you support it publicly.
Yes, but I am not allowed to advocate for its passage. I can’t tell voters to vote in November on a particular issue. I can, and will, educate the public on the bond act and what it can do for New Yorkers in terms landscape health, welfare, waterquality, and so forth. We’ll be launching a robust education campaign. I’ll leave that to the advocates who have already launched these bond act passage campaign.
You are probably familiar with Albany because you live there so often.
Too often.
You have to visit the Adirondacks more. You’re probably familiar with a few of the controversies the station has been covering. I have a few questions about those. Is it possible to renew the permit for Dunn Landfill?
We are thinking about it, of course. If it hasn’t already, the application will be submitted. We will take a hard look at it. It is now in its fifth year of operation. It has been a controversial subject and I am well aware of it. I have made it public that some of the dust from that landfill has been unacceptable. Staff have been there regularly. We’ll examine it as we do every permit and decide if it should be renewed.
What is your role in the renewal process
You know, I would only accept a role if it was offered to me at a hearing. Personally, right. My staff would ultimately handle the renewal. The renewal could be approved or denied, and a party can appeal the decision and request a hearing. The commissioner ultimately makes the decision regarding an appeal. That would be my formal role. But I know that the application is coming. So we’ll be looking at it closely. I’ll be asking my staff questions as well.
Are you surprised by how controversial this is?
No. I’m not. I get it. It is clear to me. It’s a landfill right in the middle of a neighborhood. I understand the concerns raised and I’m open to their suggestions. I also want to make sure that the construction debris doesn’t end up in landfills. It is essential to have a strong control over all construction demolition debris. You know that I reserve judgment on whether or not it belongs in this particular place.
Is Norlite in Cohoes following the dust enforcement? Or is it still at high risk of being shut down within a few weeks.
They are still at risk of being shut down. We have issued a notice to Norlite. We had one issued about a week ago and another in the last, I believe, two weeks. This is because of the large dust accumulations that they have in the community. Both the community and my staff have confirmed that dust is still a problem in the region. We take that very seriously. As I made clear with my staff we’re going ensure that, as the problem evolves, we’re addressing it. Use the full force, we’re well aligned to the Attorney General’s Office. We are prepared to take all necessary steps to end this problem.
How can dust blowing off buildings violate a permit?
That’s a great question. You wouldn’t believe what you would see unless you saw it. It’s actually dust being blown off these massive piles. They look like small hills or mountains. Some of their processes result in black dust. It is usually the wind that takes it. However, we think that there must be some controls on those piles so that they don’t become a nuisance or pose a danger to the community.
Even though the last item was almost mailed in jest it seems that people are concerned. We are hearing about the Joro Spider, a huge spider similar to your hand, that has been found in the southern states. Is the DEC worried or planning to allow this big spider to infiltrate?
Are you asking about hunting season?
Is it really so big?
Everything I’ve heard is true about the spider. It poses no danger to humans. They rarely bite humans. They are tiny, intelligent and fearful creatures. Unfortunately, they came from Japan in a tanker or some other vessel. The last thing, which I believe is important, is that the National Geographic folks who have been studying this claim that it is unlikely to migrate north. These things are unlikely to migrate north anytime soon, even though they often use their own balloons made of silk.
Do you understand why?
Although I don’t understand why, I’m happy to hear that. I don’t think they want to see spiders the size of palms as a father of three young daughters who spend a lot time outdoors. It’s an interesting story, however. But it was Murder Hornets last year. It’s just, it’s just, it’s an interesting diversion form our daily lives to think of these things.
Other invasives are also something we need to be concerned about.
This is exactly what you need.
Thank you, Commissioner Basil Seggos.
Pat. It was great to meet you again.
